By Steve Jobs popped his head out of his turtle neck long enough to issue one of his prized responses to a customer’s e-mail last week, and he just couldn’t resist dropping his now-played-out attack on the porn-ridden, adult’s only, lock-up-your-children Android Market. Can’t we all just get along? I really wish Apple could drop the petty attacks and get back to letting their devices do the talking. Here is the e-mail exchange in question:
Steve,
I was converted to Apple products with the announcement of the iPhone 3G. (My friends have been trying to convince me for years.) Since then I’ve purchased 4 iPhones, 2 computers, several routers, and miscellaneous other items. Unfortunately, I’m really starting to have a philosophical issue with your company. It appears that more and more Apple is determining for it’s consumers what content they should be able to receive. For instance, the blocking of Mark Fiore’s comic app (due to being political satire) or blocking of what Apple considers to be porn.I’m all for keeping porn out of kids hands. Heck – I’m all for ensuring that I don’t have to see it unless I want to. But… that’s what parental controls are for. Put these types of apps into categories and allow them to be blocked by their parents should they want to.
Apple’s role isn’t moral police – Apple’s role is to design and produce really cool gadgets that do what the consumer wants them to do.
Thanks for listening
-Matthew
And Mr. Jobs’ response:
Fiore’s app will be in the store shortly. That was a mistake. However, we do believe we have a moral responsibility to keep porn off the iPhone. Folks who want porn can buy and [sic] Android phone.
You can’t dislike Apple for consistently pushing innovative products that create friendly competition and push advancements for other manufacturers as well. Without the original iPhone, Android would not be seeing the huge number of new, cutting-edge handsets that are currently coming to the market on almost every carrier imaginable. Their app store also paved the way for mobile development to be a viable business model. That is plain and simple, deal with it.
But Apple has taken the competition from the smartphone marketplace to a world of ad hominem arguments. Feeling snubbed by old pal Eric Schmidt and backed into a corner where Android devices and apps are starting to compete head-to-head with the iPhone, Jobs has been flinging around the words ‘porn’ and ‘Android’ without regard. Customers need to know that ANDROID is synonymous with PORN and that by limiting the consumer’s choice in handset and apps, Apple is freeing the cell phone market from ethical peril. He is making it his personal responsibility to be a source of moral guidance, taking Google’s supposedly “bullshit” mantra of “Don’t be Evil” and rebranding it for his iPhone’s app store.
Yeah, maybe Google didn’t mean it that way, but Apple is here to let you know they are making it simple to avoid all the rape, incest, and sodomy plaguing the Android Market. Hear no evil, see no evil, do no evil: all you need to do is buy an iPhone and Apple promises they will eliminate those pesky things called choice and temptation that would otherwise make it unavoidable to infest your mobile device with smut.
[via TechCrunch]
But I can still view pornsites with the iPhone browser though, right?
This is what you do when you can’t beat ’em on merit alone, spin spin spin…
This is just one of the many reasons I wont really support Apple any longer. Not only does their tech lag in terms of innovation, but I have a strong feeling against their moral superiority and their treatment of other companies, especially Google. No thanks, I will stick with a company that does not try to dictate my life.
Apple could have a new ad.
It could go:
Are you ever traveling and want to know where the nearest strip club is?
There’s no app for that.
But on Android, you just download the app and open the application and you’ll quickly find the hours, reviews, price for a dance, etc.
So if you want that buy an android phone.
Apple’s (Jobs) petty attacks… Isn’t this type of response typical of a reprisal borne of fear or paranoia? Geesh.. Pharaoh AppLet, GROW UP.
What other content does Apple believe it has a “moral responsibility” to keep off of their products?
Here are some suggestions:
-Blocking any apps that give locations, directions, or ratings to fast food restaurants
-Blocking the ability to follow Tila Tequila on Twitter
-Blocking Republicans from M4M “Casual Encounters” area on Craigslist
-Block married famous males from texting anyone other than their spouse
-Block anyone located near Wall Street from using their iPhone to purchase/sell/discuss credit default swaps
Steve Jobs will save us all from ourselves!!!
What the hell is taking that cancer so damn long?
Personally I could care less about Apple getting rid of Porn on “their app store” after all it is their store! They have the right to sell whatever they want to in their store weather it is sold for $0 or $100.
Don’t get me wrong,I like looking at naked women as much as the next guy, but in all honesty, if you can’t make it until you get home from work to browse the web for your porn fix and need constant mobile access to it… you need help. 8)
I wouldn’t blame Google if they did the samething with their marketplace… It’s their right to refuse anything they do not want to sell.
Megalomania is an ugly thing. Who is protecting me from people who want to control what I do with the devices I buy? Funny thing is, he is just a man with his own inherent weaknesses. I have been around long enough to know the thing a person declaims loudest is what their own weakness is. I don’t need this guy to tell me right from wrong, I have my own source for that.
Judgeing by Apple stock, I’d say the customers agree with Jobs. Google deals in information, so it makes sense they are against censorship. The more information, the more money they make. Porn is big mone online. Probably one of the biggest.
Apple owns the app store, the hardware and the software, unlike Google, who does not own the hardware or software.
Apple simply does not want it’s property, hardware, software, or advertising associated with porn. Simple as that. There is no conspiracy to keep people from porn, they just want to keep porn from Apple. It is their brand, their identity, their livelihood.
Call me silly but Apple seems to be doing ok in spite of this. I applaud Apple for having moral standards, it is rare these days in the age of anything goes.
If porn is that important in peoples lives, they have bigger issues than Iphone vs Android in my opinion. But it is a free country, thus Apple has a right to run their company as they see fit.
I loathe Googles politics, but I still use a lot of their software. For some, porn is too big an issue in their lives to do business with Apple, and it is their right to refuse their business.
@cj
That is absolutely disgusting. You are a lowlife pos. Absolutely uncalled for.
Funny thing is that e-mail to Apple misses the point. As with many hardware manufacturers today, they want to CONTROL what you can do with the device you purchase and OWN. Wow… now I wonder if Ford, GM or Toyota would get away with not allowing you to drive on roads it deemed morally irresponsible? Or at speeds it felt were unsuitable for their vehicle which you purchased. How about LCD manufacturers limiting and blocking Cable TV channel access?
It’s interesting that a product corporate chairman THINKS that said company has a right to determine what you can do with their product once you purchase and thereby OWN. It’s a slippery slope he’s standing on…
@bill
the issue is not that any of us want to watch porn on our android phones. that really has nothing to do with it. the point is that I don’t want apple telling me what I can and cannot watch. this is about freedom. if you buy a device, you should be able to do with it what you please. that’s the entire point of the open source and free software movement. that is why were are all here. that is why we love android.
This whole argument is ridiculous to the point of absurdity. Has anyone here downloaded a pornographic app? I mean, what’s the point of that? That’s what the browser is for. I agree that this kind of nonsense argument is what you resort to when you have no real defense. It’s like saying opponents to the Obama administration are racists, it’s a sideshow obfuscation.
“However, we do believe we have a moral responsibility to keep porn off the iPhone.”
I assume, then, that the browser will be removed from the next version of the iPhone? I look forward to that.
“applaud Apple for having moral standards”? ~ B.S.
Any company could come out and say that they don’t want their products associated with any particular item or reputation. But for Jobs to AGAIN come out and resort to Mud Slinging directly at competitor’s products is simply evidence of him being a SPOILED BRAT.
I would assume then that the iPhone browser has a porn filter built-in to it then, cause if it doesn’t, they are not keeping porn off their products, they are just not making money off the porn on their products. In which case, Steve should not be saying “If you want Porn, go Android” he should be saying “We will not make money off of Porn.”
@sam
Fine for android, but Apple is not open source and they are not trying to tell you what you should or should not see, they just do not want porn associated with Apple branding.
@dave
A browser can be used to look at anything, an app, for porn is just that, an app for porn. Again people, apple is not telling anyone what to do when it comes to porn, but Apple does not want it’s products to be associated with porn. When did not being associated with porn become a bad thing anyway?
@CJ
fuck off dude, i don’t like jobs any more than the next guy but i’ve had cancer and went through some seriously crazy chemo treatments where your puking every night, i would never wish that on anyone, even Jobs. think before you fucking type stupid shit like that, cancer has taken 3 of my family members lives and has recently threatened mine just last summer. you think your so damn funny but your not. i truly wish there were a way for you to possibly understand what cancer feels like and what chemo does to you, but at the same time i pray you never know, just use your damn head before you spout of shit like that
@bill
The only reason apple sells is due to their name just because their stock may be doing well does NOT mean that people agree with them….It is not Apples place to tell us morals of which is why Android is doing well because its open.. and Btw you are saying blocking apps with ANDROID in the description is about MORALS? you must be high on something if you truly believe that… Apple isn’t about Morals its about making their very successful competitor look bad to customers also WHY……. they keep mention android and porn even though its old news.
Lol, this is pretty much advertising the Android platform. “Want porn? Get Android!”
Bill just answer this simple question, Is blocking apps that include ANDROID in the description about Morals? if not what is it about?
BTW Steve jobs has personally emailed me too, as well as having his personal assistant help me over the phone, try calling google for help..hell, google answers the phone just to tell you that they don’t provide phone support.
This has nothing to do with morality, if you really think it does then you’re pretty naive… It’s all about control and public perception, but definitely not morality.
Who cares? Apple does its thing and Android does its thing. Competition is good. Apple led the way, but is now being forced to add multitasking (sorta)and interface additions (folders) to keep up.
@Bill – In your first post, you said. “Judgeing by Apple stock, I’d say the customers agree with Jobs.” — I’m sure you’ve realized by now that this statement really isn’t true at all. Apple’s stance on pornography is a quite recent development and it’s highly unlikely that it has anything at all to do with the numbers they’re posting. The name recognition, branding and marketing work Apple has done, along with the release of the new products are almost assuredly the culprit.
@2fr345h
Apple is a private, meaning non government run, for profit company, in the USA and can mention or not mention their competition if they so desire. where does everyone get off demanding companies not being able to run them as they see fit. I think this Obama stuff and his trying to run free enterprise has gotten to too many people these days. I really do.
Has Apple , or steve Jobs ever told, or stopped anyone from looking at porn on their equipment? Really? Cause I want to know. Pretty simple, and it is basic Business 101.
Apple decides how to run their company, Google decides how to run theirs. Apple is not telling anyone what they can or cannot do as far as the consumer goes…Apple does not want it’s company associated with porn, why is that so hard to understand and accept? Why do people think this means they are being told to not do something? How does this even stop anyone from doing so?????
*culprits
Since when is porn evil? Were not in the 17th century…
Steve Jobs is a an ass clown, plain and simple. Apple was started as the open and creative computer company by Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak. Woz left, Jobs got canned and re-hired. He then became the all controlling idiot he is now. Anyone remember Steve’s take on DRM? iTunes DRM good! then… DRM BAD…. Now DRM A MUST! iBOOKS!! DRM GOOD! This guy is a self promoting, trash talking fig fiddler and what’s worse is people buy into Uncle Steve’s B.S. like it’s the gospel.
@Bill
that wasn’t the answer to my question. Now answer it or recognize that you are full of it.
CJ…
Pray that you never get cancer.
I like Jobs as much as the next Android fan, but c’mon now. Your’e foul comment was inappropriate.
Not sure why everybody has their panties in a bunch over this. This is purely about competition and how one company chooses to run there organization opposed to the other, that is the companies choice and freedom to do so until told otherwise by the FCC or just the government in general. The majority of us here obviously prefer Android for one reason or another, that is our choice. We know the product we are buying before we purchase it and if you don’t that is your own fault. Same goes with the latest Android Firmware, you purchase your device with a specific firmware on it, why do you EXPECT anything more than what you purchased? If you get an OTA update or the latest and greatest Android firmware consider it a bonus. I am still on 1.5 and am perfectly fine with it, I knew what I bought when I purchased my device and expect no more…..That’s my 2 cents worth.
@ Bill
How does mentioning ANDROID in their app description associate with porn? Don’t Avoid the questions asked.
@2fr35h
No it is not about morals, it is yet another business decision to notmention the competition by name. Pure and simple.
BTW, if a resturaunt opens up and decides not to serve alcohol, you have the right not to spend your money there, but does that mean they are trying to tell you what to do?
No, it does not, it just means they do not want to be associated with alcohol sales and consumption.
“20. Frank wrote on April 20, 2010
This has nothing to do with morality, if you really think it does then you’re pretty naive… It’s all about control and public perception, but definitely not morality.”
Exactly what I am saying!
Apple, Inc = Arrogant People Perceiving a Loftier Existence, In Need of Cuddling
@bill
If it was so pure and simple why did I have to ask more than once? Thats what I have been trying to tell you apple is not about morality!
I am going to buy a second Nexy just because he is such a twat.
So… bring on the iPhone browser porn filter, Jobs!
@2FR35H
Personally, I don’t care what their reasons are, probably mostly money, image as well as profits are the big factors. It is no secret Apple is in business to make money. but i will defend Apples right to do it, just like, even tho I think porn is pretty vile, Google has the right to not censor it. And i will stand behind anyone wanting to publish porn, if they want to, as long as it is legal. This is still a free country? for now, right? I think it’s great to have choices, no?
@bill
Stock prices are determined by customers’ agreement on morality with Jobs? You’re a fucking idiot. Try taking a class in capital markets.
@Covert:
agreed, btw, very sorry for your loss, i’ve had close losses as well from cancer
@cj:
in my book, you really don’t have any defense against anyone flaming you about that completely insensitive comment, no matter what anyone thinks of jobs himself
@forum:
My biggest problem with apple and it’s market is the extremely constrictive policy on what apps it allows developers to publish on the market, sometimes to a ridiculous extreme, if apple wants to start losing developers as they discover android and it’s more democratic and free (as in speech, not beer) market, that’s apple’s business
@matt
No matt, it means people are buying the products, so Apple not having porn apps so far has not hurt the company. If people get that dismayed about no porn apps with Apple, they will stop buying their products.
What is wrong with some of you people. Why so vile? Why so hateful? At jobs, at me? fucking idiot? Some of you need to get out from behind the keyboard and relax, chill, get a life. really. Is this what we have evolved to? raging over porn apps, calling people fucking idiots and wishing cancer on one another?
“Customers need to know that ANDROID is synonymous with PORN and that by limiting the consumer’s choice in handset and apps, Apple is freeing the cell phone market from ethical peril.”
You need a copy editor. Do you really think this? Or did you mean Apple thinks this?
@Bill
Now you are just talking pointless mess, nobody debated if they have a right to do what they do just that you honestly believed that it was about morals rather than anything else… Apple products are complete rip offs btw.
@Bill
Hmm… Idk maybe its because you thought the stock market proved that people agreed with the censorship that apple does or maybe its the fact that you believed that apple is about morality…
@Michael
I do believe that the editor meant that apple believed that…
Phase 2: Get porn off the Mac.
The point is that some customers (or potential customers) actually _do_ mind that Apple is deciding what apps should be available on the iPhone. Of course they have the right to make this decision, but what will be the cost to their marketshare in the long run? If the restrictions stick to items clearly identifiable as porn, then I doubt it will hurt them. But if too many app developers find it difficult to navigate what Apple perceives as “bad” then this high & mighty attitude will eventually need to be relaxed.
Me personally, I’d rather watch this play out from the safety of the Android camp.
Of course its applesstore and they can do what they want, butit would have looked better to say we do t allow porn for moral reasons, and leave it at that. Dragging android into the statement is what makes Jobs a jerk about it. Morally high to not include porn but not above libel
That’s easy, Bill; we’re living in an age we’re transnational companies have more power than governments do. Thus constraints that intelligent people thought about for governments a few centuries ago get important for companies as well.
Jobs needs to check out his app store before he makes comments like this. Sure, he might not have actual porn apps, but there are plenty of apps that are borderline and/or come close to it…at least in my opinion. Stuff I wouldn’t really want my kids to have.
Who is Jobs kidding? I was all over m.pornhub.com this very morning.
…on my iPhone.
lol sounds like JOBS should be browsing some internet porn on his iphone cuz he sounds sexually frustrated. android is closing in on the iphone, all over the world, its inevitable, to slam android like that is low, but not at all surprising from a man who thinks hes a god because the whole world sits in awe whenever he reveals a new iphone thats basically the same as the prior versions save a few upgrades, but anyone with a previous version has to go out and buy a whole new iphone….even with my 2 yr old GI from tmobile, when a new OS is available i get it automatically OTA for FREE….i dont have to go out and buy a new phone every single update…so yes JOBS is frustrated, hes on a sinking ship, and he knows it. slamming porn apps is all he can do to criticize android, its superior, its popular, and the world is slowly realizing that. ..yes i too agree the cancer comment was a bit too much.
And jobs really needs a PR manager, he’s the only publicly overly opinionated a-hole I’ve ever heard. Not business mannered at all.
Ted Haggard X Rich Geek = Steve Jobs
So Mr. Jobs thinks they have a “moral responsibility” to keep porn off their site, yet they made no hesitation to inform the world of their decision with Proposition 8? Riiiiight. You cannot have it both ways sir. Either you are a company with morals, or you are not. Do not follow Disney’s route.
Remember when Apple was the cool company that really understood their customers? They’re blocking porn apps (and anything that shows a woman in a bathing suit or underwear) now, but what’s next? Now they’re blowing off adobe since they don’t need the professional market any more. They’ve turned into such a bad company!
This is another of those famous reality distorting statements of Steve Jobs, with applications from companies like Hooters, Playboy etc, and with a browser SAFARI where one can see anything related to porn, Steve Jobs still makes this pointless comparison
Don’t listen to him, it’s all hot air, just another blow Jobs.
@CJ “What the hell is taking that cancer so damn long?”
That is so wrong but for some reason I can’t stop laughing. I’ll never buy Apple’s overrated/priced products.
ummm fuck you OtisFeelgood, your a low life SOB….
ummm eat a dick, Covert.
@CJ
I no this has been said alot, but that’s just terrible. If you want to make a joke try to use something that doesn’t offend anybody
one web browser is approximately equal to any other- safari is no exception… way to go steve- bash the competition… below the belt…
hahahaha, as if mr. jobs! surely you recognize that your Phone consumer base would literally be cut in half if you removed all the pron surfin’ iphone nerds who only jerk to your iGlory (and i bet there’s an app for that!). I know the Japanese do :D
And then there are the ones… you know the ones that camp out to pick up your exorbitantly priced, over-hyped phone w/ antiquated ui, only to retreat to their caves for hibernation until the next lukewarm update; they like pron too. Afterall, Internet porn is a 3 billion dollar industry
Nevertheless, we don’t need some loud mouthed fruitcake at a podium to teach us about morals. That’s what the education system, and Jesus camp is for.
Between this and his comments on Flash, he sounds utterly inept in his logic. But I’m sure 3 million sniveling sheep who perceive his fecal matter as a holy elixir would disagree. One word: tools. Maybe your demagod is *FINALLY* successful at market branding (you know, after Microsoft destroyed them in the mainstream computer pc biz). But alas, so is Brittney Spears, and the Kardashians, and Sarah Palin. What does that tell you?
Apple can do what they want, and the have lost me as a customer ( I’ve been one since the Spple //e days…).
What I don’t like is Apple sounding more and more like the government-“I know what is best for the user.”. While YOU and many others may not mind, I do.
If you like Apple, fine. But please don’t throw up sales figures as “the end all.”. If that is the case, MS rules, China is the best, …
Hot air is hot air-even if you like Apple’s products. Surely you can see that?
@(-)3r0
I think everyone just needs to either calm down, or grow some thicker skin. Most people that see posts they don’t like, ignore them. If you want to find a place that doesn’t offend you, you should probably stay away from the internet.
btw, Covert (and everyone else that was offended) Why even respond? Cancer survivor here too ftr
This is not about freedom of choice vs moral
superiority. That is mere spin. The real reason
Apple wants such rigid control is to maximize revenue.
The company is primarily a tollbooth on the internet
which makes decent money on hardware…much like buying
a razor or a printer just begins the money outflow.
@ihatefanboys,
What are you talking about? You have it completely backwards. While we G1 owners (I have had mine since it came out) are stuck at 1.6 and will never be upgraded to “real” Android (2.1 and higher), people with first gen iPhones from 2007 are running the latest version of the iPhone OS only minus some features due to hardware differences between them and newer models. And yes they got these upgrades for free. Now iPhone 4.0 will require upgrading if you are using a 1st or 2nd gen iPhone but if you are you’re due for an upgrade through AT&T any way. What’s more Apple is FAR from a sinking ship. The company has seen it’s PC market share double in recent years and it controls the smartphone OS market. Yes eventually Android might eclipse the iPhone OS but that will only be because of the number of manufacturers producing Android phones. Remember that you can only get the iPhone OS on an iPhone and you can only get an iPhone from Apple. When you consider this fact Apple’s current market dominance is simply staggering. Consider all of the Android devices that are on the market right now today. Now add in RIM, Nokia, and MS. The iPhone OS’s market share is as large or larger than all of them combined. Love Apple or hate Apple you have to be impressed by that. No single manufacturer has as yet mounted a challenge to them that has gone anywhere. The iPhone has been on top for three years now which is a lifetime in the tech world. So let’s avoid too much hyperbole here. Google and Android aren’t going anywhere but neither is Apple and the iPhone. Frankly I think Apple’s market share will either hold or grow because the iPhone is and always will be something Android isn’t and never can be, an iPod. No other media playing device or media playing app comes close to the fit and finish and ease of use of the iPod whether stand alone or on the iPhone. I know that a lot of you are like me. You have an Android phone and an iPod because the iPod is just easier to listen to music on or watch a video on or even buy either on. While we’re on the subject it’s worth mentioning that the Android ecosystem offers no analog to iTunes either. Yes I know there is syncing software but that isn’t what I’m talking about. I’m talking about one program that allows you to purchase media, syncs it to your phone, and backs up your purchases and your apps. It’s doubtful Android will ever have anything like that unless Google wants to build it’s own relationships with all of the major record labels, film studios, TV networks and now publishers; and then design, program, build, test, and distribute an application that runs on desktop OS’s and plays nice with all of the myriad permutations of Android that various device manufacturers have created.
Android is an ever splintering field of devices, manufactures, and OS versions with no clear or cohesive marketing strategy to sell the OS to consumers. iPhone is one device from one manufacturer on one carrier (for now) with one clear consumer relatable message. On Android you can do whatever you want but if we’re all honest it’s a mixed bag of great apps and garbage that force closes every time you try to use it. On iPhone you can do most of the things you want and the trade off is that all of the apps, even the garbage ones, will work pretty seamlessly. I think that’s the real distinction that Jobs is trying to make and I think it’s an important one. You sacrifice some choice for the stability and intuitive user experience. On Android we take the good with the bad. The other important point to make here is that the iPhone does have an app (and very often a very good one) for almost anything most people want to accomplish on a handheld. You cannot say the same for Android yet. So really what are iPhone users really giving up? All of the JD Power & Assoc awards for customer satisfaction would lead me to believe that the only people bemoaning Apple’s control over their app store are people who do not use iPhones.
@Bill or whomever can provide an answer
Bill said ” BTW, if a resturaunt opens up and decides not to serve alcohol, you have the right not to spend your money there, but does that mean they are trying to tell you what to do?No, it does not, it just means they do not want to be associated with alcohol sales and consumption.”
seriously can anyone name a restaurant that does not serve alcohol? (not including fast food or vegetarian or maybe even religious places)
Steve Jobs,
It’s time you gave back the 1984 commercial.
You Sir, are the one on the screen.
@WTFMoses
No that your post is really germane to the discussion or even addresses the point the commenter was making but since you asked just off the top of my head: Perkins, Denny’s, Embers, The Manhattan Diner, Super Dog (might be considered fast food), Shake Shack, The Convention Grill, The Carnegie Deli (maybe), Mickey’s Diner, and I don’t know any number of diners and mom and pop joints across the US. ;)
When the iPad was launched, some Adobe boss used an image of a porn site to illustrate the importance of Flash on the web. This led Jobs to comment that Adobe was ‘playing the porn card’. The success of his ocmment led him to believe he can play an anti-porn card on Android.
In the seventies, VHS was crowned as the de facto video standard, whereas Betamax and esp. Video 2000 were far superior. The reason? Wider availability of porn titles on VHS in the US. As history always repeats itself, Jobs will lose the porn battle. And yes it may be convenient to be able to get porn on a handheld device, I can imagine.
btw, the parallel with video systems is weak ’cause Android is superior anyways :-) That probably scares the hell out of Jobs.
A company that wants to keep malware and crapware from their store – OK.
A company that wants to be a moral guardian, removing everything which doesn’t fit into their corporate image, or might be offensive for someone, and the process in which they decide whether an application is “worthy” for their product is less transparent than the censorship offices in communist countries – not OK. What if the Republican Party promises them that they’ll replace all government PCs with Macs if Apple supports them? Will they remove every book about evolution, every religious book except the Bible and will they reject every Democrat-branded app? Censorship is a very slippery slope…
Here’s my 2 pennies.
“seriously can anyone name a restaurant that does not serve alcohol”
Not off the top of my head, but there is a reason why the term BYOB exists. Liquor licenses are VERY expensive.
@bill
“…even tho I think porn is pretty vile”
“Why so vile? Why so hateful? … Some of you need to get out from behind the keyboard and relax, chill, get a life. really. Is this what we have evolved to? raging over porn apps…”
My response to your first quote is your second quote. Sure there might be some fetishes in porn on the extreme end, but in general, I think porn as a whole is pretty far from being vile.
@pie-eater
While I agree Andriod is superior, and that Apple has always been inferior (never an Apple purchaser, currently enjoying my HTC Hero), I believe the video parellel has truth.
I had a Beta and agree it’s quality was far better than VHS when it appeared. VHS was cheaper, and porn may have helped too despite the inferior product.
Steve on the other hand, is on the losing end of both of these. Add on his communistic, child-like approach to things, he should be scared and may be in need of iShorts 2.0!
While I could care less about content and features that don’t interest me personally in a mobile phone (or anything else), I like to know I have the choice to them if I desire. I’m a big boy and can make my own decisions Steve!
edit: ‘I had a Beta and agree its quality…”
Don’t want to leave my comment open for an Apple fan to claim inaccurate because of a typo!
@pie-eater,
Porn isn’t why Beta lost. Porn would have been just as successful on Beta. Beta lost because Sony refused to let go of Beta and allow other companies to make tapestock and decks. JVC licensed out VHS and that’s what allowed it to be the defacto standard and pushed Beta out of the market. Porn made home video successful and as I said it would have done no matter what the standard was.
What’s more I think you should all read Jobs’ comment again. All he’s saying is that he doesn’t want to sell porn. As others have said, he has that right. Not store owner has to carry a product that they do not want to sell. What Jobs said was if you want access to porn on your handheld then go buy an Android device. I don’t understand how all of you, including the article’s author, have taken this as a slight against Android.
Now a short play where Apple and Google run rival newsstands:
Jobs: “No pal I don’t sell porn here. try the guy down the street.”
You guys: “FUCK YOU BUDDY! I hope you die of cancer! How dare you keep me from buying porn at your store. I should just go down the street huh? Well you must be scared shitless about your position in the market if you are informing me that your competitor is willing to sell me porn. I will go down the street because I actually always shop there any way and have never bought anything from you but I still have strong feelings about your refusal to sell me porn in a hypothetical world where I DID buy stuff from you.”
End scene.
@Gerusz
What point are you trying to make? Now Apple is Communist or Republican or what? As @jeremyryancarr said in his long but I thought thoughtful post, let’s keep the hyperbole to a minimum. Do any of you even know anyone with an iPhone? I mean seriously what do you think Apple is keeping off of the device that has such dire consequences to the free world? Some porn apps? Apps that mention their competitors? Oh no! I don’t know a single iPhone owner (and I know many) who feels like they’re losing out on anything. Quite the contrary actually. The App store is awash in quality apps from major developers that are easy to find. I wish the Android market worked half as well and had half the selection quality. Maybe I just don’t know as many diehard porn addicts as you folks. Most the people I know aren’t having any trouble getting the real thing.
#58 ROTFLMAO!
You nailed it!
I sat through the keynote speech announcing iPhone OS 4.0, and I could not help thinking that this guy in the turtleneck sure seems like a douche. Based on the clothes, the way he acts, his commentary on the new product, and his tone, it’s just my personal opinion.
As far as a business choice, I don’t like the conformity that Apple imposes on their customers or the control that they have in the app store. Combine that with the cat and mouse game that Apple is playing with the hackers and it became too much for me. I bought an N1 and it is the best device I have ever owned… since my iPhone 3G. Android is the OS that is capable of competing with Apple.
Apple deserves credit for putting all of the pocketable devices into one platform and making it useable and sexy. Windows Mobile has been doing everything that the iPhone does for at least the last 8 years. But where Microsoft failed Apple succeeded; making a device that is easy to use, attractive, and especially in its marketing. Even Nokia was working on the same idea but could not get it right.
For now, the average iPhone user does not really know what they are missing; ask one if they have the first clue about what multi-tasking is and whether they lament its omission from their iPhone. Chance are you’ll get blank stares all around.
HTC and Motorola rolls out new Android devices every damn month, each one better than the last. How can Apple compete on a 6-12 month release schedule, deliberately leaving out functions (regardless of whether the hardware ACTUALLY supports it) to obsolete their devices and force upgrades? People will catch on soon enough.
Apple still has an ace up their sleeve: marketing. People are sheep; they don’t know what they want until you tell them. I don’t think the general public knew what Android was until Verizon and Motorola said so. Now everyone wants a Droid. Google has not sold a fraction of their flagship device when compared to the Droid because of a total lack of marketing on their part.
Steve Jobs talked about all of these “new” features that are coming to the iPhone in OS 4.0 like Apple invented them. And people eat this shit up. Multi-tasking is old news, folders are old news, ebook readers, Unified inbox, integrated contacts… the list goes on. Apple did not invent these things, nor does it look they are improving on them. They are just playing catch up… to Android.
@80 and @81
Job’s didn’t just say “I wont allow pron on the appstore”. That’s not what the problem is here. What he DID say was this : “I won’t allow pron on the appstore, if you want that than get an android”. Thereby trying to put a negative spin on android, rather than just stating his moral ground. THAT is why hes a DUMBASS JERK, NOT FROM SUPPORTING HIS MORAL GROUND WHICH OF COURSE IS HIS RIGHT, BUT THEN LAMBLASTING OTHERS FOR NOT FOLLOWING THE SAME COURSE, NAMELY, ANDROID.
GET THAT THROUGH YOUR HEAD DUH!
@ jeremyryancarr
“No that your post is really germane to the discussion or even addresses the point the commenter was making but since you asked just off the top of my head: Perkins, Denny’s, Embers, The Manhattan Diner, Super Dog (might be considered fast food), Shake Shack, The Convention Grill, The Carnegie Deli (maybe), Mickey’s Diner, and I don’t know any number of diners and mom and pop joints across the US. ;)”
side note: i hate to be the grammar police but i think you meant to say that my post is NOT germane to the discussion or the point the commenter was making.(getting your point across depends on the correct usage of that word in particular) also no should be know. but thats low hanging fruit.
i totally agree with both of your points.
the first point being that that my comment/question has nothing to do with the discussion or Bills “point”. my comment/question does however relate to Bills “comment”. Bill gave an example using restaurants serving alcohol.
the second point being that there more places than i originally thought that do not serve alcohol. (though i personally only recognize two of your examples, i have thought of other nonalcoholic establishments)
can i make an amendment to exclude diners? (i know thats pushing it)
@ Brad
agreed
Haha! Great article. I personally am not going to use my Android for porn…and the stupid MiKandi app wasn’t that explicit, at least when it came out…but I will be using my phone for tons of free content, apps, and just feel the freedom that comes with the most customizable phone on the mainstream market. One thing I find hilarious about the iPhone is they’re just barely getting multi-tasking and even just customizable wallpapers that extend beyond the lock screen:) I can see the TV spot now; “And you can even change your homescreen wallpaper to any picture you want!” Oh wait is that just on the iPad? Meh I guess we’ll see…either way it fricken hilarious.
@Counsel
Agreed my friend.
@Brad
Thank You, Brad!! That IS THE POINT here. Period. End of discussion. I’ve owned/used/supported Apple products for over 10 years. I can no longer associate myself with such a PosterBoy of arrogance and now a mud-slinger toward his competition. What an a$$, Enough is Enough.
@All those that use apps figures to compare:
Get another point to make. After 3 years of developer support, of course there’s an “app for that” to just about anything useful. As well as they SHOULD work smoothly by now! sheesh.. 3 years to get the bugs out!
@Brad,
How does Jobs stating that he doesn’t allow porn and then offering an alternative to his product that DOES offer porn make him a “DUMBASS JERK”? Bob owns a green grocers. Bob doesn’t sell bananas because they look like penises and that makes him uncomfortable. Jerry’s Foods does sell bananas so you should buy them there. Does not selling bananas, stating his reason for not selling bananas, and then informing you that Jerry does sell bananas make Bob a “DUMBASS JERK”? You could if you were predisposed to not like Bob insinuate that what he is really saying is that Jerry LOVES penises and loves to sell penises. But when you look at what Bob really said, that simply isn’t the case. Jobs: “…we do believe we have a moral responsibility to keep porn off the iPhone. Folks who want porn can buy and [sic] Android phone.” All he is saying is that he is keeping porn off of the iPhone and that you can get porn on Android. Literally that is all he said. He did not say: “I would never sell porn because it is gross and horrible and people who consume it and sell it are dicks. Android doesn’t block porn so they are dicks and all the dicks can go buy Android.” See @Brad that would have been lambasting. Just pointing out that consumers have options is not lambasting. Seriously are we Android users so thin skinned and defensive that every time the CEO of a competing platform developer mentions Android we take it as a slight? Look at these comments. Directionless, misinformed, mean, and distasteful. A lot of you make all Android users look like a bunch of Troglodytes, Morlocks, and CHUDs. The way some are defending the access to pornography makes me think that our Android using ranks are full of creepy guys who are rubbing one out under their coats in the back of the bus. Put down your phones, clean the spittle from the corners of your mouths, and get out there and meet some real people. Oh and @Brad, you’re caps lock is stuck on buddy. Embarrassing.
@skilcraft
No, I disagree. By saying “…we do believe we have a moral responsibility to keep porn off the iPhone. Folks who want porn can buy and [sic] Android phone.” Jobs insinuates that android has no moral responsibility. It brings the focus on the “morality” of the decision, rather than the decision itself. Simply saying – “We dont allow Pron on the iPhone for our own Moral reasons” is explanation enough. There is no need to bring up other carriers. It’s as if you said “I dont have anal sex with my girlfriend because I believe it’s wrong, if you want that then go see Julie”. So here, rather than describe a personal decision and leave it at that, you also cast the second person in a negative light by insinuating that your way is correct. The statement should stand on its own, it does not need any comparisons to others. Jobs should have simply stated “We have a moral responsibility to keep pron off the iPhone”. That would be enough, and in fact would have cast him in a more positive light.
@WTFMoses
I did indeed mean NOT. It was late and I was tired. But if you look closely, which should be easy because you quote me, you will see that I did in fact use know and not no as you imply.
Denny’s, Embers, and Perkins are all terrible chains to be avoided but you really should seek out the other places I mentioned if you have opportunity to travel around this great land. Even if you would have to bring your own booze;) Exclude diners!?! Banish the thought. The disappearing diner is essential to the American experience. Um… What I mean is iPhone sux! Android forever! Down with Jobs! Or something.
The other reason that us “phandroids” jump on these things by Steve is because he’s the only CEO I know of that is so blatantly vocal in a totally non-PC or businesslike manner. He really acts like a jerk when he says the things he does! And it’s just rude and unprofessional, and needs to stop. It’s not how a CEO should be interfacing with the world. He should be focusing on positives of his products, not the negatives of his competitors. Leave that to the advertisers and to politicians.
@Brad,
I am not willing to cede the point as I do believe that you are taking implication where none is offered. However I will meet you half way. Suppose that is what Jobs is saying. So? Aren’t all of you essentially arguing just that. Aren’t you all arguing that in fact Android has no moral responsibility? And that that is in fact a feature you all enjoy? Isn’t Android’s lack of a “moral filter” and the perceived benefits thereof the very point of Kevin Krause’s article? You can’t have it both ways. You can’t have an Android free of censorship and then get pissy when someone points that out. “We don’t allow porn because we are morally opposed to it. Android does allow porn because they are not.” That’s not what Jobs said but even if it was wouldn’t it be the truth? Again Kevin Krause and a lot of you here are saying that Android’s lack of controls is a feature and one that informed your decision to support the platform. So why the indignation about a perceived slight?
@Brad,
Yeah but that’s who is and who he always has been. He’s an old school Silicon Valley guy. He and Ellison are pretty much the last of that breed. These are guys who built empires in garages. These are guys who gambled everything and made something out of nothing. Jobs isn’t an MBA hell I’m not sure he even finished his BA. People who love him love him for the very reasons you’re railing against him. He’s passionate about what he does and he talks trash because that’s the atmosphere he came up in. Frankly I think Eric Schmidt’s a great CEO but he’s boring as all hell. Silicon Valley has lost a lot of it’s edge and it’s teeth over the years.
why doesn’t Mr.Jobs apply that same moral high ground to the Chinese manufactures he employs to do his bidding. he is a fraud at best.
Kevin Krause,
You state “Jobs has been flinging around the words ‘porn’ and ‘Android’ without regard.” yet you do not link to any evidence to support this assertion. Where has Steve Jobs made it clear that “Customers need to know that ANDROID is synonymous with PORN”? The implications you make in this whole post are spurious at best but not offering citations for your claims is just sloppy journalism. You started this whole tempest in a teapot by writing a post based entirely on your own implications about what Jobs REALLY meant and yet upon review there is nothing of substance to back up your writing. Also since when is “making it simple to avoid… rape, incest, and sodomy…” a bad thing? Consensual sodomy aside, you do realize that rape and incest are bad things right?
@jeremyryancarr
haha i liked the part where you switch topics:)
just let me clarify one last thing. the “no” i was referring to happens to be the very first word with which i quote you.
“No that your post is really germane to the discussion”
@bill if you need phone support from a company like apple or google, then you shouldn’t even be using computers. thats’ a pathetic excuse and i’m sick of you constantly referring to the porn issue. countless people on these forums have tried to explain to you that it’s not specifically porn that is the issue but you continue to defend it like it is. apple has controlled not only the users of their products more and more over the years, but now the third party developers now, AS WELL AS companies who design software platforms or frameworks to help third party developers CREATE software EASIER (adobe). instead of using porn as an example think about flash. the answer steve jobs and that crappy company gave to consumers is that it’s inefficient and that it would waste battery. the proper answer is to leave that up to the consumers choice. flash was shown on an htc dream in 2008 and it was running fine, i’m not going to hear those nonsense reasons that this apple company so loves to throw out there. you can dislike google’s ‘politics’ all you want but the fact is google is just a better company all around than apple, and will continue to be as apple just becomes worse and worse.
@skillcraft
Direct Jobs Quote:
“You know, there’s a porn store for Android. Anyone can download them. You can, your kids can. That’s just not a place we want to go” in case you missed him at the stupid ipad conference
@skilcraft
did you happen to be on a debate team in your school days?
when Kevin makes the statement about how Jobs makes it simple to avoid “rape , incest, and sodomy” (and i realize Jobs never said that)i think he is pointing out that when Jobs makes statements like “we have a moral responsibility to keep porn off the iPhone. Folks who want porn can buy and [sic] Android phone.” Jobs implies that because Android does not censor the android market Android is in support of immorality and porn. that is what makes jobs statement irresponsible. the truth is that Android is in support of freedom. they respect you as a consumer. that as a consumer you can decide what is right or wrong or immoral for yourself. and are devs making rape apps?
@skilcraft,
Firstly, the excuse of “this is how I always have been” in regards to Job’s way of doing things is never a good enough reason to pardon improper behavior. If in most people’s eyes he acts like an ass, then it’s time to correct behavior. Although I do agree with you that many people look up to someone that says what they think, it will tend to polarize people – which is what Apple seems very good at doing.
Also, as you can see grindking at post @95 shows the whole statement of Jobs, which as I said attempts to apply fearmongering. While the statement is no doubt true (you can get Porn on Android of course), it ignores the fact that porn is certainly available thru the conventional web browser on the iPhone as well anyway. It’s an argument which takes only basic facts and tries to present them in a way that puts the competitor in a bad light. Personally I would have much more respect for Jobs if he simply would have stated his company/personal position on the matter and left it at that. There is no need to try to “scare” people of other products. That there, is the a-hole move on his part. Did he mention Windows Mobile? Symbian? No, he mentioned only the product which appears to bear him the most threat. It’s simple conventional mudslinging.
@ kcid
Haha, thanks! Was wondering if anyone got it ;)
@grindking,
Fair enough but is it a lie? What’s wrong with him pointing out the truth? What’s wrong with drawing a clear distinction between what your company allows and what your competitors allow? Again I think it boils down to Jobs saying: “We won’t offer it but they will.” If it was a lie I could understand the outrage but it isn’t. You can access porn apps on Android and so can your kids. Besides which two occurrences that require a fair amount implication on the part of the reader do not a company wide directive make.
Now your previous point regarding Adobe is of more interest to me. Firstly I was at AdobeMax back in ’08 with my then new G1 in hand when Adobe showed off Flash on that selfsame device. I heard their promises of delivery and have been waiting ever since. I also work in the Film, TV, and ad industries and as a result I have used most of Adobe’s products on a Mac for years. I can tell you that Adobe has been far from kind to our community despite our loyalty to them for years. Every time Apple has upgraded OS X Adobe comes out and promises the moon only to fail to deliver. CS3 wasn’t upgraded to support Snow Leopard so I bought CS4 which wasn’t upgraded to support 64 bit so I’ll have to buy CS5. I have given that company close to $10k in the past half decade and they have failed to deliver obvious and necessary features time and time again. So I don’t put much stock in what Adobe says or promises and I can understand why Apple as a company may be a bit sore at them. But to the issue at hand. While it may at first blush seem like Apple is just being a dick to Adobe I do think they have a legitimate reason for banning apps developed using an intermediary application like those in CS5. Namely long term reliability of those apps on the platform. Every time Apple releases an API they make sure that their developers have it immediately. Apple announces the new features coming to the platform in the morning and has the development tools available for download that afternoon. I know this because I have seen iPhone app development firsthand when creating apps for ad clients. If you are developing your apps using an intermediary product that ports your Flash app over to the iPhone then you have to wait for Adobe to update that program and then recompile your app and hope that Adobe did their homework. As I said in my professional experience Adobe is very unreliable. It does hinder development of the platform if you have everybody using different systems to develop their apps instead of one approved and tested way. The iPhone does deliver a near seamless and very reliable user experience. That is simply fact. I have been with Android since ’08 I have lived through the growing pains and often they have been painful. Most of my colleagues have iPhones and they have had a much easier go of it.
I’m not sure what your experiences or credentials are that allow you to formulate the judgment that Apple “has controlled not only the users of their products more and more over the years..” as a Mac user I would say this total hogwash. My options have only grown with the company’s success. Then you call Apple a “crappy company”. Well remember that this “crappy company” made the Mp3 player mainstream in ’01, invented the for profit digital distribution business model in ’03, and revolutionized the stagnant handheld market in ’07. All of which paved the way for companies like Google to gamble on products like Android. Also this so called “crappy company” just posted a 89% sales increase for the quarter in a recession. If that’s crappy in your book then I’ll take double.
@WTFMoses,
I just grew up in a household that fostered argument and debate.
Exactly what I am saying is that you are all getting bent out of shape over a lot of implication. Implication is nothing. You can argue over what someone was implying forever and never come to a conclusion. As I showed in my previous examples often what you take as an implication has everything to do with your perception of the person speaking. One could also argue that NOT banning something is in fact tantamount to a tacit approval of it.
There may be a rape app but I’m stuck at 1.6 and you probably need 2.1 or higher to run it. KIDDING.
@Brad,
I’m not making excuses and neither is Jobs or his shareholders. As I stated, 89% sales increase for the quarter in a recession. You may not like his style but like Dirty Harry he gets results. More mild mannered CEO’s are losing their companies or begging for bailouts and Apple is posting these kinds of numbers in an otherwise flat tech segment. Also with $40 Billion in cash on hand I think we can let go of the the idea that Apple and Jobs are afraid of anyone at this point. They don’t need to maintain dominant handheld OS market share in order to stay profitable. As has been said, Android may over take them but it will only be because the OS runs on many manufacturers devices at many price points. Apple’s profit per iPhone sold will stay consistent and with nearly 9 million sold last quarter I don’t think there is a lot of hand wringing going on at 1 Infinite Loop.
@Brad,
Sorry for the double post but I forgot your point about the browser and I think it’s important. You are correct. You can access porn on the iPhone through the browser as you can on any browser. If anything this is evidence that Android’s own fear mongering re: Apple controlling their customers is BS. You are free to visit any site you like on your iPhone, iPod, or iPad. No questions asked, no judgment rendered. This is not however inconsistent with Apple’s of Jobs’ statements. Apple has always supported an open internet (unlike Google until recently) and Jobs just refuses to accept profits from porn. Apple makes $0 off where you go on the web on your iPhone but they do make $$ on each app sold. They just want to keep that $$ “clean”.
Mr. Jobs’ statement just reinforces my theory that he is and has always been a moronic talking head.
@ skilcraft
Most of your posts are TLDR, but that last one got me: Apple supports an open internet? Do you have any links for reference? As I see it, Apple only supports its products, and its own app store. Arguably, none of which could be described as “open”.
I take these comments as Jobs reaction to Androids market share gains. It just reeks of not being as confident about his product as he has been in the past.
@skilcraft
very true. you’ve actually almost won me over. the only thing in your response that i dont agree with is “Implication is nothing.”
example: i imply that sally is a big ho bag in a conversation with a group of people. this group of people have never met sally and did not previously have any opinions on sallys character. when they finally met sally the opinions they form are more likely to be negative. that is not fair. sally does not want the group to think she is a ho bag. even if it is true that sally is indeed a ho bag, sally is at a disadvantage when she meets the group. therefor i was irresponsible when i spoke to the group.
its sad that you have to say joking after a joke nowadays isnt it?
Give me my Mac, give me my 64-bit Safari;
I’ll love thy computers oh Steve.
But I say to thee:
give me my Android & let me be free.
Apple decision not letting porn in apps is nothing wrong but the way Steve said it is very wrong.
Hi there STEVE :) remember me? imma get you while you sleep >:) CANCER’S GONNA GET YOU NOW!
The way Steve said it is very wrong.
the world needs to know they only commission other companies in Taiwan and Japan to design the iPhone.
Like how Sony is the real engineer of Powerbook