By A lot of things have happened inside the courtrooms in the ongoing epic battles between Samsung and Apple, but there is just as much action outside the ominous halls of justice. Apple has long been rumored to be dwindling its dependency on Samsung for several components, including displays and batteries, and the biggest move of them all could be looming.
DigiTimes reports that Apple is ready to leave Samsung’s semiconductor manufacturing business hanging at the altar as the former is supposedly going to bypass the latter for Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company, the biggest worldwide player in this space. Samsung is said to be getting as much as $13 billion next year out of its deals with Apple, and this move could put a huge dent in those figures.
It’s possible that Apple would deny this move has anything to do with their newly-developed rivalry with Samsung, but considering nothing has been confirmed then their reasoning is anyone’s guess. But being the drama lovers that we are not ashamed of being we have to immediately go with our first suspicion — Apple is simply trying to cripple Samsung wherever it can.
Whether or not this would actually hurt Samsung’s bottom line is an entirely different numbers game altogether, but keep in mind that Samsung is still the world’s leader in mobile phone shipments, and the company still has a billion other business bringing in loads of dough.
One has to question whether Apple actually has the gall to go through with such a move, though. Samsung’s losses would only be monetary, and if we can assume that many of its other partnerships and businesses don’t fall through then the beat will move on. But what if Apple is the one who could come out on the sour end of this move?
TSMC was said to be responsible for a slight delay in the mass production of the Snapdragon S4 chipset that almost affected the launch of several HTC devices earlier this year. While that anomaly isn’t commonplace you have to wonder whether or not a transition from Samsung to TSMC could potentially hurt Apple for future device launches. TSMC would have to scale its capacity to meet the huge demands of Apple while maintaining a balancing act for the likes of Qualcomm and NVIDIA.
It would be one of the biggest transitions we’ve ever seen in the embedded semiconductor space, and a lot of moving parts involved could make this a risky and tricky move for Apple to take. We have a feeling that the Cupertino company would be willing to take that risk, though, if their hate for Samsung is as strong as we think it is.
Either way, it will be an interesting day if Apple ever decides to go through with it and we’ll be front row and center to see it all taking place. Who do you think would be hurt the most by such an action?
[via DigiTimes]
So let me summarize, apple is loosing market share in their smart phone sales. Samsung’s sales are going through the roof on so many models it is hard to keep track of. The Nexus-4 can’t stay in stock for longer than 60 seconds ……… Gee, I wonder where the new processors will be sold ?
OMAP
TI want’s out of the mobile space.
“apple is loosing market share in their smartphone sales”
iPhone Market Share In U.S. Overtakes Android, Research Firm Says
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobileweb/2012/11/27/iphone-market-share-in-us_n_2196861.html
Funny how this story never made it to phandroid…I wonder why :-)
Android still dominates everywhere else and this is only a slight bump before the slide for Apple and is really no surprise. Once the iPhone 5 hype dies off, Apple will be in another big slump as the Galaxy S4 and other high end Android phones begin to show up.
It’s not being widely reported everywhere because it’s almost a non-story.
Dominates what, exactly??? Profits?? Nope. Developer interest? Nope. App Store revenue? Nope. Customer satisfaction? Nope. Web usage? Nope. All of Android’s “domination” hasn’t given it a single advantage that matters, other than to be able to say, “we sell a lot more cheap, commodity, zero-profit junk than you do”. So whenever you fandroids talk about Android “dominating”, the question I ask is, dominating WHAT???
Your mother’s face
I guess for me, it ‘dominates’ by my friends and family having learned enough now after their first smartphone to compare and switch over to an android device when their current plan ends. My older friends and relatives like the iPhone but see something just as good in Android and prefer the choice of larger screen for their slowly worsening vision. Friends my age and younger choose what we enjoy, iPhone or Android. I think the trend in the future (and perhaps in countries where there are ‘older’ smartphone users) will be towards sales of smartphones larger than the 2 choices iPhone has.
Dominates marketshare – and it matters in the long run. Apple’s profits are already being squeezed because of competition -and it’s only going to get worse. Why do think they are scrambling to sue left, right and center? It’s not because they can, it’s because they see the writing on the wall. Profits are down and investors are getting more wary which is reflected in the stock price. They can’t even produce a decent phone without tons of glaring bugs. Their maps are crap and people are jumping ship.
Developer interest? Been there done that – you can find pretty much everything you want/need in the Google Play store. Also right out of the box Android is less gimped than IOS. Customer satisfaction? The Galaxy S3 RAPED the iPhone to be number 1 not just on looks….. people LOVE it. Web usage? Who cares? If Apple sheep purchase their I-whatever mainly to shop, not my problem.
“We sell more cheap, commodity, zero-profit junk”
Yeah I guess, the S3 is cheap zero profit junk and that’s why Samsung raked in tons of cash selling them.
The more versatile platform will weather the storm a whole lot better. And that platform is Android.
Yeah marketshare matters in the long run….I guess that’s why Hewlett-Packard as of just a year ago was on the verge of shutting down their PC division….despite the fact that they were NUMBER ONE in marketshare. It’s profits that matter in the long run…and this is where Apple has no rival. Google Apple’s Smartphone profits vs Samsung and you’ll see who the runaway winner is….spoken like a true clueless fandroid that has zero business sense.
Try finding Infinity Blade, Street Fighter x Tekken, Fight Night Champions, Nba 2K12, Soul Caliber, etc for Android…you have a second rate, malware infested App Store with some of the most worthless apps I’ve even..
“Customer satisfaction? The Galaxy S3 RAPED the iPhone to be number 1 not just on looks…..people LOVE it”
iPhone Tops Smartphone Satisfaction Survey (Again)
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2401687,00.asp
Pure, unadulterated ignorance on display for the world to see…
Web usage indicates that iPhone users find their phones a lot more useful than Android users…period ;-)
The vast majority of Android phone contributing to their marketshare are not phones like the S3; it’s the cheap, commodity junk that you can buy at gas stations and grocery stores. Add in the fact that you get endless BOGO deals and penny deals on Amazon. But the startling fact is that with the nearly 100 OEM’s that use Android worldwide, exactly ONE has seen any profits. And the distance between Apple and Samsung in terms of profits is so vast its laughable. Simply put, Google by giving Android away and thereby commoditizing it, has produced one of the WORST business models ever. For the majority of companies using Android it has been an abject FAILURE….
Wrong again….the more PROFITABLE platform will weather the storm a whole lot better. And that platform, my friend, is iOS :-)
“Try finding Infinity Blade, Street Fighter x Tekken, Fight Night Champions, Nba 2K12, Soul Caliber, etc for Android…you have a second rate, malware infested App Store with some of the most worthless apps I’ve even..”
You listed all games… So what you’re saying is that the iPhone is a toy?
;)
No sir…..most toys are made out of PLASTIC :-)
Ooooooh snap!!
“Yeah marketshare matters in the long run….I guess that’s why Hewlett-Packard as of just a year ago was on the verge of shutting down their PC division….despite the fact that they were NUMBER ONE in marketshare. It’s profits that matter in the long run…and this is where Apple has no rival. Google Apple’s Smartphone profits vs Samsung and you’ll see who the runaway winner is….spoken like a true clueless fandroid that has zero business sense.”
Apples and oranges, the desktop market is mature and has pretty much peaked already plus it’s filled with a lot more competitors. The mobile landscape is in its infancy and right now has only TWO major players and getting ready for at least 4, sorry but marketshare matters a whole lot at this point in the race, and it is STILL about reaching the masses. The more your system is exposed the more likely people are going to invest in it.
Of course profit matters, it’s the very reason businesses exist but it’s not divorced from market share especially in the mobile landscape. Without a large enough consumer base you have little to no shot at long term profitability.
Most of Apple customers are repeat buyers and they have slowly bled share to Android over the years. With the increasing competition comes pricing pressure and lower profits. Because Android’s landscape has been so competitive, it’s system has matured quickly, more so than IOS in both software and hardware. Will Apple be able to sustain its current cost structure without sacrificing profit? Nope. Eventually they will be forced to at least match the competition in features at the same price point (the public will demand it) or LOWER PRICES which is sure to erode the bottom line. It is happening already.
“The vast majority of Android phone contributing to their marketshare are not phones like the S3; it’s the cheap, commodity junk that you can buy at gas stations and grocery stores.”
The vast majority of Android handsets in the US market are smartphones all capable of web browsing. Even the free ones on the big Carriers require a data plan of some sort unless they are prepaid.
“Try finding Infinity Blade, Street Fighter x Tekken, Fight Night Champions, Nba 2K12, Soul Caliber, etc for Android…you have a second rate, malware infested App Store with some of the most worthless apps I’ve even..”
LOL! You can’t be serious. 99.9% of Android users could easily live without those games. What’s important to most are email (Android wins), Mapping and Navigation (no brainer : android wins hands down), Web browsing, (Android has more options and capabilities in the browsers availabe – a win for sure), messaging, video calling and some gaming (there are enough games to satisfy most appetites). That right there covers about 90% of the smartphone userbase.
“But the startling fact is that with the nearly 100 OEM’s that use Android worldwide, exactly ONE has seen any profits.”
Someone else has shown that statement to be a startling lie.
“Google by giving Android away and thereby commoditizing it, has produced one of the WORST business models ever”
Really? Google makes money on the advertising, they are not about selling software and hardware although that could change in the future. If that’s the WORST business model ever it’s not showing. And so many OEMS would not choose to compete if they thought it was a losing proposition. Some will lose for sure, but some will certainly make money and have.
Actually, it is quite the apples to apples comparison. What it demonstrates is that in ANY business, profits ensure sustainability. Show me a profitable company and I’ll show you a company that will be around for the considerable future. Marketshare, as we’ve already seen with HP, ensures NOTHING. Ideally, a company would like to achieve significant profits AND marketshare, a feat that Apple manages with relative ease. But marketshare without profits is a merry-go-round: you think you’re on the move but you’re actually going nowhere fast….
The vast majority of Android phones that contribute to their marketshare are poorly built, low processing power, laggy, buggy pieces of dispensable garbage….that’s not even debatable…
Wow…I’m glad that you know what’s important for all Android users! You obviously don’t visit game forums where legions of fandroids are distraught at the second class nature of games in the Android Market….errr….Google Play. Maybe you don’t realize it, but games are the MOST downloaded types of Apps on either platform…plus all of the “wins” you have declared, with the exception of Maps (and as someone who uses Apple Maps daily the issue has been completely overblown) are subjective at best….
Care to provide a link showing that Samsung being the only profitable Android partner is a lie? I’ll post a link showing that it is indeed true, courtesy if one of your fellow fandroid sites:
http://www.droid-life.com/2012/01/09/manufacturers-woes-opinion/#disqus_thread
Google has admitted that mobile search is hurting its main business, desktop ads and is causing an overall “deceleration” in company revenue growth:
http://www.businessinsider.com/google-admits-mobile-ads-are-causing-deceleration-in-revenue-growth-2012-11
So lets summarize: you don’t make any money from Android because instead of licensing it, you give it away; 99% of your carrier partners aren’t making money on Android; And your mobile ad business, the reason you provide Android in the first place, is causing a slowdown in revenues for your entire company….what a brilliant business model
“Actually, it is quite the apples to apples comparison. What
it demonstrates is that in ANY business, profits ensure sustainability. Show me a profitable company and I’ll show you a company that will be around for the considerable future. “
Ha you make it too easy. BlackBerry was a very profitable
company just a few years ago and what happened? Their market share tanked and so did their profits…..to the point that their future existence were in doubt.
http://www.mobileburn.com/19115/news/rim-sales-revenue-tank-in-q4-2012-earnings-report
I can show you many other examples but that’s a glaring
one. Palm is another. They were profitable, didn’t make compelling enough products to appeal to the masses and disappeared – all within a few years.
Profitability simply means a company is making money on each
sale and is probably on the right track to sustained growth. It is certainly
NOT a guarantee they are on the right track for the long term.
“Market share, as we’ve already seen with HP, ensures
NOTHING. Ideally, a company would like to achieve significant profits AND
market share, a feat that Apple manages with relative ease. But market share without profits is a merry-go-round: you think you’re on the move but you’re actually going nowhere fast….”
But the significance of market share in the desktop vs the mobile markets aren’t the same.
In a highly competitive very mature market like that of the
PC desktop market, razor thin margins are the norm and has been for a loooong time. This is certainly not the mobile market of today. 10 years from now, maybe. There are still a lot of people without smartphones. What’s hurting some Android OEMS is simply demand – people are not buying enough of their products (for many reasons I’m not going to get into).
Samsung has the greatest share and the greatest profit. HTC
and Motorola both made tons of the money early on but lost share to Samsung. You simply cannot talk about profit with talking about market share right now(in the mobile market). It still has a long way to go before maturing to the point where market share doesn’t matter as much.
The desktop market pie on other hand is cut up into so many
pieces that market share isn’t of much significance as it used to be- mainly
because competition is beyond fierce and margins are very thin.
Hp’s market share for 2011 was around 16.9-17%. The next in line, Lenovo, was around 13%, Dell 10%-12%, Acer 11%. And the rest was 40%. Honestly, that’s not a significant difference in share between them, and they only make up roughly 50-60% of the market. Also HPs share as well as many of the others have stagnated for the most part over the years.
Like I said apples and oranges.
To answer your question about Android profitability for
Google:
http://techcrunch.com/2012/10/18/googles-mobile-run-rate-is-now-8-billion-up-from-2-5-billion-a-year-ago/
“The vast majority of Android phones that contribute to
their marketshare are poorly built, low processing power, laggy, buggy pieces of dispensable garbage….that’s not even debatable…”
In your opinion. I’ve owned the cheap and the higher end and never had a problem . Yes the lower end models are a bit laggy but I expected that – you get what you pay for. In contrast My Galaxy Nexus is a work horse and butter smooth.
“Wow…I’m glad that you know what’s important for all
Android users! You obviously don’t visit game forums where legions of fandroids are distraught at the second class nature of games in the Android
Market….errr….Google Play. Maybe you don’t realize it, but games are the
MOST downloaded types of Apps on either platform…plus all of the
“wins” you have declared, with the exception of Maps (and as someone
who uses Apple Maps daily the issue has been completely overblown) are
subjective at best….”
Games aren’t the driving force behind adoption. Value for money is. Android simply offers a better value. And for every 1 Android
user complaining about the lack of a specific game, there are 10 who couldn’t care less. Plus some of the more popular ones ARE on Android.
“
“Care to provide a link showing that Samsung being the only
profitable Android partner is a lie? I’ll post a link showing that it is indeed
true, courtesy if one of your fellow fandroid sites:
http://www.droid-life.com/2012…”
Here are a couple:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-10-24/lg-electronics-posts-3rd-quarter-profit-on-mobile-phone-earnings.html
http://www.idownloadblog.com/2012/08/17/apple-wont-be-no-1-in-china/
“Google has admitted that mobile search is hurting its main
business, desktop ads and is causing an overall “deceleration” in
company revenue growth:
http://www.businessinsider.com…
So lets summarize: you don’t make any money from Android
because instead of licensing it, you give it away; “
I’m not sure how you can conclude they don’t make any money with Android when mobile ad revenue is actually increasing. They made over 2 billion in revenue. The article is about the future ad business on
the desktop where the price per click on the mobile side would in effect
cannibalize the desktop……….but they’re still raking in the dough and the market doesn’t seem too worried as their stock has been stable .
“99% of your carrier partners aren’t making money on
Android; “
?? Not sure what you mean here. Verizon is making money when
they sign up people for contracts – even
when they give phones away. They are actually making more selling Android phones than Apple mainly because they bend over for Apple.
“And your mobile ad business, the reason you provide Android
in the first place, is causing a slowdown in revenues for your entire company….what a brilliant business model”
A slowdown means just that. Desktop search /ad revenue isn’t going to disappear overnight or a long time to come. Having survived so long, I’d say Google has a SOLID more future proof business model.
“Ha you make it too easy. BlackBerry was a very profitable
company just a few years ago and what happened? Their market share tanked and so did their profits…..to the point that their future existence were in doubt.”
And where is the evidence that Apple’s marketshare is tanking? Quite the contrary: it’s growing! Not growing at the rate of Android (nearly impossible; commodity always outgrows premium) but there is no evidence to suggest that Android’s rise has come at the expense of the iPhone, evidenced by their yoy growth in profits AND marketshare. What people like you don’t understand is that it was never Apple’s intention to be the marketshare leader, because he rightly understood that in order to do so, he (Steve Jobs) would have to sacrifice profit margins. His initial goal was to capture between 5-10% of the global market….mission accomplished.
“In your opinion. I’ve owned the cheap and the higher end and never had a problem . Yes the lower end models are a bit laggy but I expected that – you get what you pay for. In contrast My Galaxy Nexus is a work horse and butter smooth.”
Thank you for proving my point :-)
I stand corrected about LG: so now there are a grand total of TWO OEM’s that are making profits on Android. My original point still holds true: the vast majority of Android partners are not making money. As for that other company you posted, the article simply stated that they had nearly a billion dollars in REVENUE. Says nothing about profits. Surely you understand the diffence between revenue and profits ;-)
“Games aren’t the driving force behind adoption…value for money is”
Translation: Much of what Android has to offer is cheap. You are certainly right about that. Although I would add that with the iPhone being made available for $0 on contract, and with rumors of Apple offering a less expensive iPhone off contract (particularly for those that live in developing nations) Apple will soon be more competitive on that front as well. But games are still the most downloaded apps of either platform :-)
“I’m not sure how you can conclude they don’t make any money with Android when mobile ad revenue is increasing. They made over 2 billion dollars in revenue”.
Again, you appear to be confusing REVENUE with PROFITS. 2 billion in revenue doesn’t mean 2 billion in profits. Also, mobile ads are platform agnostic. Adsense ads are found on iPhone, Android, Blackberry, Windows phone, etc. That has nothing specifically to do with Android. The way that they could make money directly from Android is to simply charge OEM’s a small license fee for it…much like Microsoft Windows. They would still achieve high market penetration and make money from the software…a win-win.
“The article is about the future ad business on the desktop where the price per click on the mobile side would in effect cannabalize the desktop…….but they’re still raking in the dough and the market doesn’t seem too worried as their stock has been stable”
Mobile price per click ads are significantly less valuable than desktop ads which led to Google posting disappointing earnings and a SHARP DECLINE of their stock price: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/19/technology/google-shares-drop-after-earnings-disappoint.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
My mistake; I meant to say that 99.9% of your OEM partners aren’t making money on Android….
Google’s “SOLID” future proof business model is anything but. Their business model has provided the following:
No monetization from the OS itself (they give it away instead of licensing it)
No profits for the vast majority of their manufacturing partners
Declining overall revenues for the company due to low mobile ads rates
Plummeting stock price as a result
No real demonstration of how to capitalize on the shift to mobile other than vague statements like “We’ll figure it out”
You’re right….what a SOLID business model
“And where is the evidence that Apple’s marketshare is
tanking? “
I Never said it was…..at least not yet.
“Quite the contrary: it’s growing! Not growing at the rate
of Android (nearly impossible; commodity always outgrows premium) but there is no evidence to suggest that Android’s rise has come at the expense of the iPhone, evidenced by their yoy growth in profits AND marketshare. “
http://techcrunch.com/2012/10/25/apple-q4-2012-earnings/
Look at the graphs for the Android effect. It’s plain as day. Yes earnings were great but they are ‘blips” They start out great and slowly drop
off. Same with profits. If Android didn’t command the market share it has now,surely IOS would have taken up the slack, so to say Android’s rise had no effect on Apple’s earnings is to ignore the obvious.
“What people like you don’t understand is that it was never
Apple’s intention to be the marketshare leader, because he rightly understood that in order to do so, he (Steve Jobs) would have to sacrifice profit margins. His initial goal was to capture between 5-10% of the global market….mission accomplished.”
The problem with this approach is that it assumes the onsumer base that currently pays a premium is going to continue to do so and I believe that’s only a short term bet. The problem is the perception of quality can be manipulated and the competition, by playing to that perception, can compete on the hype as well. This is evidenced in the Galaxy S3, a phone that
even the staunchest pro-Apple publications had to admit is a great
product. If a few of the OEMS can capture some of that hype, Apple can surely kiss their margins goodbye unless they can magically find some way to lower costs.
“In your opinion. I’ve owned the cheap and the higher
end and never had a problem . Yes the lower end models are a bit laggy but I expected that – you get what you pay for. In contrast My Galaxy Nexus is a work horse and butter smooth.”
Thank you for proving my point :-)
What point? That cheaper phones are slower, more laggy? That’s a given with any brand. I owned an iPhone 3g and compared to the 3gs
it was night /day in terms of performance or smoothness. The 3g stuttered and lagged all day when given a lot to do and required reboots
and a fair about of software updates. Now for the grandma and grandpa who
occasionally looked at pics, played solitaire and made a couple phone calls the 3g was great. For a power user it sucked, plain and simple.
“ As for that other company you posted, the article simply
stated that they had nearly a billion dollars in REVENUE. Says nothing about
profits. Surely you understand the diffence between revenue and profits ;-)”
There are no hard numbers for this company yet for a bunch
of reasons. But pretty much every website and analyst’s opinion about them all seem to agree on one thing – they are sure to make a profit on every phone sold because of their cost arrangements. Here is just one.
http://www.wantchinatimes.com/news-subclass-cnt.aspx?cid=1502&MainCatID=15&id=20120905000001
This company grew very fast in a couple years and procured
investments from several venture capitalists. Surely they saw the potential.
“Games aren’t the driving force behind adoption…value
for money is”
“Translation: Much of what Android has to offer is cheap.
You are certainly right about that.”
If a superb set of Google services (services that Apple devotees crave for but pretend not to)and an excellent versatile powerful OS is ‘cheap’ then I don’t know what to say. If you’re talking about the hardware that Android runs on as of right now, then I’d only agree if we’re talking ‘freebie’ phones.
Even the Optimus line of the phones for around $50.00 (like the l9) are
fast enough for normal everyday use. They certainly aren’t a power user’s choice but they definitely get the job done.
“Again, you appear to be confusing REVENUE with PROFITS. 2 billion in revenue doesn’t mean 2 billion in profits.
Also, mobile ads are platform agnostic. Adsense ads are
found on iPhone, Android, Blackberry, Windows phone, etc. That has nothing specifically to do with Android.”
Wrong. Google makes revenue on Adsense, Admob AND Google Search on Android and currently Android is the market share king of the world. It was roughly estimated back in 2011 that Google made some profit on every handset sold:
http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2012/05/15/googles-android-profits-40-of-a-little-is-a-lot-less/
Since then Android’s share has grown a good bit so you do the math. And while that article wasn’t very flattering when profits were compared to that of
Apple, it did admit there was a profit made and I have little reason to doubt it. If you can show me otherwise, please do.
“The article is about the future ad business on the
desktop where the price per click on the mobile side would in effect
cannabalize the desktop…….but they’re still raking in the dough and the
market doesn’t seem too worried as their stock has been stable”
“Mobile price per click ads are significantly less valuable
than desktop ads which led to Google posting disappointing earnings and a SHARP DECLINE of their stock price: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10…”
Google’s stock is back up near 700, where is Apple’s? A 20% sell off in 2 months is indicative of perceived instability going forward. Investors are weary of Apple’s future profit margin sustainability and I don’t blame them.
“Google’s “SOLID” future proof business model is
anything but. Their business model has provided the following:
No monetization from the OS itself (they give it away
instead of licensing it)”
It’s an investment. They make money on the resulting ad
clicks and searches.
“No profits for the vast majority of their manufacturing
partners”
This is true but it’s up the manufacturing partners to
attract the public to their products. Samsung and LG here in the US have done it, so why can’t others? There are still quite a few
people without smartphones. Can’t fault Google here, selling hardware isn’t their core business and Android functions just fine.
“Declining overall revenues for the company due to low
mobile ads rates”
The market doesn’t seem to think this a huge problem right
now. We’ll have to wait and see.
“Plummeting stock price as a result”
Since the initial decline, their stock price has been stable…
then climbing. Like I said, it’s back up near 700, you might want to check your facts.
“No real demonstration of how to capitalize on the shift to
mobile other than vague statements like “We’ll figure it out
You’re right….what a SOLID business model”
If people were going to stop browsing (mobile or desktop)
over the next few years, I’d be really worried for Google, but that’s not going to happen and is likely to increase. Google’s search engine is
still no 1 and there are still a lot of untapped markets and potential.
Have you ever stopped to consider while talking about the zero profit junk you call android how apples high quality products are bringing in higher profits in hardware while selling smaller numbers while simultaniously pumping out big money in marketing? could it possibly be that it’s the same junk that you lament on similarly featured android models sold at a higher margin (Read: Pricetag) while producing the illusion that it’s pricepoint is somehow tied directly to it’s quality so consumers feel less buyers remorse. Fact is regardless of weather or not it’s a good phone Apple is making huge profits because it’s doing something that no other major electronics manufacturer does these days: sell high margin.
While the Chinese market share of android increase above 90% in China.
Yeah….and the Chinese government OUTLAWS all of Google’s services meaning Google is getting absolutely no benefit from being in China.
I guess outside exposing a LOT more developers in China to Android.
That is from a 12 week sampling, including more than a month into the iphone 5 launch. Who do you think you’re fooling?
Classic shoot the messenger :-)
Um, sure? I’m just pointing out a rather large flaw in your sample and thus your claim. If you are incapable of accepting facts, that isn’t my problem.
Where’s the flaw? For the last 12 weeks iPhones have outsold over 200 plus Androids COMBINED in the U.S. And that happened despite being on one less major carrier (T-Mobile) and a whole lot less regional carriers. Those are that facts the YOU are having a hard time accepting, not me :-)
The flaw seems to be in your understanding of what market share means. iPhones do not have a larger market share in the US than Android, despite what you seem desperate to believe.
Product releases provide short term distortion, but you don’t seem to be able to accept that. What if I were to extend that 12 week block to include the next two weeks which includes nexus 4 sales and galaxy note 2 sales? You see, selectively choosing data to try and prove a point is ridiculous. Want a real picture, look at the last year.
The simple fact of the matter is that there should be absolutely no time when three phone models outsells over 200 especially since those three models are on FAR less carriers. That is flat out embarrassing
lol, that isn’t how your deity, Mr. Jobs, saw it. Troll smarter, not harder.
Because the huff and puff post is the paid add type stories you should not put your money behind
You know Apple is only big in America right? Apple is only 5.5% of world market…Both Nokia and Samsung sell over 400% more phones each than Apple. The iPhone is niche product that sells well in America for some reason.
Apple is going to have to chose to either dilute their brand with a less expensive device that can compete or ignore Android global dominance and continue on as they are. They simply will not be able to maintain the margin they enjoy. All hardware eventually becomes commoditized despite best intentions.
Apple takes 71% if the profits in the the smartphone industry. Of the dozens of OEM’s making Android phones exactly ONE (Samsung) is turning a profit; and the gap between Apple and Samsung in smartphone profits is astronomical. Apple is under no pressure to dilute their brand to “compete” with Android. When you are walking away with nearly 3/4 of the profits, there is NO competition….
Umm…you know all this proves is that Apple is charging WAY to much for it’s phones, apps, music, books, computers, software, etc… 5.5% of market share with 71% of the profits means that the poor saps who are in that 5.5% are getting bent over daily and willingly by Apple everyday.
Good point. Perhaps more attention should be paid to Apple’s profit percentage of the smartphone industry over time. Do you know what it was this time last year? We can then compare today with 1 year from now and see if it grows, shrinks or stays the same. On the other hand it may just turn unwanted attention towards Apple should their profit share start trending down.
Apple is under TONS of pressure. The iPad Mini was one sign of that. The dwindling stock price is another. Their patent trolling is yet another.
The question is:how long are the Carriers going to subsidize Apple’s overpriced mediocre phones just to say they carry them? Verizon got beat up more than once and I suspect they aren’t going to bend over for too much longer.
Also I smell another winner from Samsung on the horizon……
Apple better enjoy those profits while they last.
5.5% of the world market, 71% of the profits….but in the minds of fandroids, it’s more important to make sales than to make money
@DroidDoesnt_2
It’s odd to see people bragging that they paid too much.
Apparently, in the mind of the iSheep it’s important to overpay for your device just so the church of Jobs can rack up a $100 billion pile of cash.
Who paid too much? I paid the same $199 subsidized price for my iPhone as you probably did for your iPhony….talk to the carriers who actually subsidized the device, not me. And the fact that they are STILL willing to meet Apple’s demands in the face of a sea of iPhone wannabes shows the importance of Apple’s brand….why don’t u ask T-Mobile how being the lone major carrier without the iPhone is working for them. The number one reason why people LEAVE T-Mobile? They don’t sell the iPhone :-)
I pay 15 per month for voice + data (360 for 2 years) and 350 for the Galaxy Nexus. So 710 in total for 2 years.
Now how much do you pay per month (or 2 year total) to see who actually “subsidizes” your iPhone?
BTW I can imagine pretty much the only reason to leave T-Mobile is if people *must* have the iPhone. Like I said, they just love paying too much.Like you, they even brag about. WOOT, we overpaid so much, Apple is swimming in cash!
What iPhone wannabes? I bet you think the iPhone 5 was the first smartphone with panorama. Apple hasn’t been innovative in years, you iSheep still cling onto this false belief that every other phone is a copy of the iPhone. Enjoy your overpriced phone.
It’s probably because the carriers subsidize so much of the iPhone’s price so that it can be competitive with phones from other brands.
At most apple can retain that title “in the u.s only” for about 3 months. Historically, iphone sales putters very quickly like a hollywood blockbuster on its 3rd weekend.
What you should be concern about is how quickly ipad market shares are eroding to android.
Eroding marketshare by selling their tablets at or below cost and losing money in the process. OEM’s having to drastically reduce their prices, cutting or eliminating their profit margins JUST to attract buyers. I’m sure the thought of its competitors LOSING money has Apple absolutely terrified….
Ok, look at it this way, Android is now more than ever the “people’s” OS. It is a lot more accessible due to the varied devices and price points. In quite a few countries there are no subsidies for the smartphones. All Apple has to do is match that model if they care about it. But that is not Apple’s model. With devices becoming better every month there will come a point where iPhone and iPad will reach its ‘stable’ point and grow no more market share. Samsung is the closest competitor now. What stops them from eventually turning to buying out another Android OEM they believe is innovative, incorporating those developments and making their products even better? The same option does not exist for Apple since they are the only ones producing iPhones. There is a lot more effort being put into device development in the Android camp than the iOS at this point simply because there are so many companies producing devices using Android.
Ha! Consider the sources. Huff post and Kantar WorldPanel? I’m sorry, but you had to chuckle a little bit when you posted that….. Come back when a REAL research group has market share updates (Forrester, Gartner, etc.).
Look at who’s saying this and you’ll know why: Kantar WorldPanel. These aren’t real numbers! Kantar is a consumer panel research firm. They don’t research or report on actual shipping or sold volumes, therefore their market share numbers are nothing more than opinions, not facts.
Yep…and I’m sure that if Kantar had Android on top that you’d still be saying “these aren’t real numbers!” right??? Sure you would :-)
Actually, I sure would…but then again…no real news site would report on it. Just like they didn’t with Apple supposedly on top. You can’t determine market share by doing surveys lol.
“You can’t determine market share by doing surveys lol.”
You mean like this comScore SURVEY that detailed Android’s recent market share numbers? http://www.comscore.com/Insights/Press_Releases/2012/8/comScore_Reports_June_2012_U.S._Mobile_Subscriber_Market_Share
Like every other comScore SURVEY that is posted on this site???
Pure, unadulterated ignorance….
Exactly….ignorance. Especially considering how comScore gets their data. THEY get data from multiple sources, not just surveys. They use on device metering, info from browser and in-app ads, and various other sources in addition to surveys. It has ALWAYS been considered to be a much more accurate source of analytics and thus IS reported by major news agencies. SMH
comScore Reports June 2012 U.S. Mobile Subscriber Market Share
U.S. Smartphone Market Tops 110 Million Subscribers in June
RESTON, VA, August 1, 2012 – comScore, Inc. (NASDAQ: SCOR), a leader in measuring the digital world, today released data from the comScore MobiLens service, reporting key trends in the U.S. mobile phone industry during the three month average period ending June 2012. The study surveyed more than 30,000 U.S. mobile subscribers and found Samsung to be the top handset manufacturer overall with 25.6 percent market share. Google Android continued to grow its share in the U.S. smartphone market, accounting for 51.6 percent of smartphone subscribers, while Apple captured 32.4 percent.
It’s a survey sir….something YOU said cannot produce marketshare numbers….not me, YOU….ignorance
because that (USA) is just one Country compared to the rest of the world – where Android has the largest market share.
I Suppose you are willing to over look this this ‘minor’ FACT !
Actually, if Android’s market share actually meant anything it would be different….it is totally meaningless. 99% of the companies that use Android are LOSING money….so what exactly does it mean??? But you are right about 1 thing, it is a very MINOR fact :-)
Which companies are those? That should be almost all of them, right? Name ONE. Even companies that are struggling like HTC made money. HTC for example made over a quarter of a billion dollars last quarter. Haweii made almost $1.5 billion. Motorola made 28% more money year-over-year last quarter ($324 mil…AFTER spending over $300mil repurchasing shares). LG made $2.26 billion last quarter (also up). The only company I know of that lost money was ZTE, and that was due to a downturn in their network infrastructure business, NOT their Android handset sales…which are booming. Deal with it: this is a replay of the late 80’s-early 90’s all over again, but considering you are obviously an Apple fanboy you wouldn’t remember that era lol.
You obviously don’t understand the difference between revenues and profits….
Probably because it was ‘overtaking’ Android by just 1.4% in the 12 weeks (ending Oct.31) where iPhone5 sales are counted. Considering that the comparison is done outside a normal Quarter (Jan-Mar; Apr-Jun; Jul-Sep; Oct-Dec) the report looks more like a desparation move to show a lead at the ‘best’ time. If the iPhone5 can maintain the boost in share resulting from their product launch through the end of December perhaps it will feel less like fluff and be listed here on phandroid.
perhaps because no one reads the HP. perhaps because it reads more like an advertisement than any sort of news article. perhaps in part because it is a small snapshot of the immediate aftermath of the new iPhone release, and prior to any new big android release. a better measure will be how the two brands do through the holiday season.
And perhaps if your auntie was a man he’d be your uncle….perhaps if Mitt Romney got more votes he’d be President….blah blah blah, Yada Yada Yada
Okay, everyone, stop feeding the troll. He’s just here to get on our nerves, and from the looks of the replies, it’s working.
neither will be hurt. Samsung doesn’t just make chips and Apple will find someone else.
Exactly. I’m sure Apple isn’t the only company that is interested in Samsung’s chips.
Interesting take. But you never know until it happens.
Well let’s think about this. If Apple takes their business to TSMC, who is going to be squeezed at TSMC while they try to meet Apple’s demand? Qualcomm. So who’s going to be looking for a new fab partner that can reliably meet demand? Qualcomm. And who’s going to have the capacity and capability to meet such a need? Samsung.
Even if it doesn’t play out exactly this way, the moral of the story is that it’s really not going to affect much except possibly the rate at which Apple can manufacture iPhones and iPads (likely slower because TSMC had difficulty producing enough S4’s). The supplier market will work itself out. You have companies like Qualcomm, Nvidia, Apple, and AMD which need fabs to produce chips and fabs like GlobalFoundries, TSMC, and Samsung to produce them. If a major player like Apple decides to shift, the rest of the supplier industry will work itself out to equilibrium once again.
….I said it wasn’t going to affect them. Not sure why you needed to write out a novel to agree with me..lol
I’ll admit I’m bad about writing novels. There’s a few in this comment section. not trying to contradict you, just building on your point.
Ahh okay. At first I thought maybe you read mine wrong or something. Haha
I hope Apple does this, and burns many other bridges along the way, and it all backfires on them.
i hope you are absolutely right. And also i hope no one agrees to manufactur chips for them. Apple has yet to learn what it is like to be bullied, i hope this teaches them.
From all indications, the only reason Apple has stuck with Samsung as a supplier this long is that they’re the only ones able to meet the insane demand of an iPhone launch. We saw it with Apple switching screen suppliers and ship times for the iPhone 5 slipping. Like stated in the article, we’ve already seen delays from TSMC with the S4, so how exactly are they going to fare taking on the iPhone in addition to existing contracts? Moral of the story, they probably won’t and they may delay shipment of key Apple products, a bad proposition for Apple.
“TSMC was said to be responsible for a slight delay in the mass production of the Snapdragon S4 chipset that almost affected the launch of several HTC devices earlier this year. While that anomaly isn’t commonplace…”
It’s more commonplace than folks think. I recall TSMC having delays due to yields multiple times in the past for Nvida graphics processors as well. TSMC has a history of delays in particular when dealing with fab shrinks.
I don’t think Apple would make such a stupid move. So, this is all
just Apple letting loose a rumor trying to get Samsung to lower their
prices and perhaps stop pushing Apple so hard in the market and the
courts.
If this take is all there is to it, then I expect Samsung will see through the scheme too and continue as usual.
OTOH, it would be wise for Apple to have a minority share of as much of its
product line as possible diversified away from one supplier. Maybe they
are trying to conflate these two: pretending a minor shift could be a
major one just to get better terms with Samsung.
Last I heard TSMC doesn’t have the capability to produce as many chips as Apple needs, Samsung was and is the only company that can handle that amount of chips, Apple would be stupid to just switch and then not have enough chips when they introduce a new revision of the same thing they have been releasing
Perhaps they are just trying their hand at the ‘just-in-time’ Toyota supply model. Since they had to slow production down to avoid damaging the iPhone5, they need less chips ‘now’ since they can’t build it as fast as before.
A few other OEMs have been using Sammy’s chips already this year. And as the first ever A15 used in the Nexus 10 reference platform is also made by Sammy, it’s likely that even more OEMs will be keen to jump on the Exynos train next year. So maybe things aren’t so bad for their bottom line.
They dropped Google Maps without having a solid and reliable backup plan. This might be just another bad move made entirely out of spite for Samsung and anything Android.
For Tim Cook supposedly being a supply guru, this sure seems like a boneheaded move. Samsung is and will likely continue to be the only supplier capable of meeting the demand associated with an iPhone launch. If they switch, it is likely that they will see delays which will negatively affect their massive launch strategy.
it’s not an apple article until Cupertino is mentioned.
Yes…Apple…you want this?
Hehehe
Strike them down with your hatred and your journey toward the dark side will be complete…
This makes it seem like it’s all Apple who wants to terminate the relationship. But just couple of weeks ago Samsung stopped selling batteries to Apple, too. This has been going back and forth for a while, until all the relationships they have are terminated. I think Samsung still supplies them with displays for now.
Yeah but remember who started all of this. Do ‘thermonuclear war’ ring a bell?
Here is what will happen. TSMC doesn’t have the capacity of production, will subcontract the Apple chip production back to Samsung. Samsung then raises the price 20% which TSMC add another 30% so that Apple ends up paying 50%. Fed up, Apple decides to purchase TSMC so that it can keep the production for itself. Only to discover that the whole time, all the chips were subcontracted to Samsung.
Apple then get rid of TSMC at a huge loss and beg Samsung to do chip again for them. Samsung buys back TSMC for a bargain price and upgrades TSMC factory to manufacture chip for Apple with +100% increase in price. At that time, Apple is near bankruptcy. Finally AOL saves by purchasing Apple.
As AOL has a particular talent to killing whatever they touches, in less than 3 months they kill whatever remaining at Apple. Not being able to do electronics anymore, Apple changes its business and become a manufacturer of slippers (iSlipper), fake hand bags (iBag), fake perfume (iSmell). Finally Apple is delisted from NASDAQ and the iPhone trademark is sold to ToyRUs, the iPad trademark is sold to a manufacturer for a feminine product line.
I like the way you think my friend :-$
that last paragraph made my day hahaha
I believe SNL did a skit on just that version of the name when the iPad first came out. For those ‘not so fresh’ days.
Great story!
Best post of the day
LOL!!!! That would make a great story!
LOL!!! funny as F@#K
1 million is nothing to them… but 13 billion.. ouch.
Nah. They’ll be alright. They won’t actually lose $13 billion, just $13 billion from Apple. That void will likely be filled by someone else.
For instance, Qualcomm may be interested in filling that void because once TSMC starts manufacturing for Apple, Qualcomm will be second fiddle to Apple. This could result in more delays to Qualcomm chip shipments (considering the aforementioned S4 delays). Samsung has proven to be able to fabricate a large number of chips reliably and quickly for Apple, so it stands to reason Qualcomm may sign on the dotted line with them.
Another, less likely proposition would be for Samsung to buy AMD. AMD would compliment Samsung’s business nicely and they could terminate agreements with GlobalFoundries and TSMC to produce AMD chips and manufacture them in the fabs vacated by Apple. Getting out of supply contracts with TSMC and GlobalFoundries would likely be easier than you think with the Apple move because TSMC would be looking to offload some manufacturing to meet Apple’s demand. Additionally, Qualcomm may look to GlobalFoundries to meet demand not met by TSMC. The supplier rejiggering would allow Samsung to more easily terminate existing AMD supply contracts so that GlobalFoundries and TSMC could produce more chips for other vendors and Samsung could bring AMD chip production in-house.
Personally, I prefer the latter scenario as I think it makes the most sense for Samsung to expand it’s product and supply reach, fill the Apple sized hole in their supply chain, and save AMD. I think the former is the most likely scenario especially considering that Qualcomm already contracted Samsung earlier this year to help meet S4 demand that TSMC couldn’t meet.
Sounds familiar…like when Apple removed Google Maps because Google is a competitor. We all know how well that played out for them.
I would like to see Apple drop Samsung components only because Samsung is a competitor and alienate more users because they made their product less desirable in the process.
Everybody already nailed things in the comments…I just find it amusing that Apple (read: Tim Cook) is going to make a business decision like this… It seems foolish. What do I know, though?
Yep, time for Samsung to buy AMD. They need something to fill the manufacturing void left by this, and AMD would round out their portfolio nicely.
i hope motorola buys that company – tomorrow.
Its not just about capacity but about tried and true facilities that can build parts that passes minimum quality. Its one thing to ramp up and say, yeah I can produce millions of phones. But will be fun when fanboys cry because their overpriced ipads suddenly die left and right.
Then apple will have to deal with wall street.
the iphone will be blackberry of tomorrow. blackberry was also hot a few years back. and now its loosing ground to apple and android. and the the I phone will loose ground to Samsung unless that’s already happening.
when apple does leave samsung it’s going to hurt sammy’s profit at first but i’m sure sammy can find other customers to replace apple in no time
Apple why won’t you just go away, just go away.
I agree jus go away apple syndicate.. Lol.. ( >< )
Samsung’s loss is easily calculated and only monetary (which is important to a company). The risk Apple would take here is simply huge and I am highly questioning this move from the Apple front. Such a significant part as a CPU manufacturer is not something easily changed. Many things could make Apple’s life very difficult down the road. Delays are only one issue. What about quality which Samsung obviously managed to provide. Imagine that all of a sudden incompatibilities between the CPU architecture and iOS will popup.
Could be a maps all over again. Samsung has the capacity and experience and have been raising prices because of demand. Apple, if they don’t plan better than they did with maps, could end up shooting themselves in the foot.
Before today everyone on this site was bitching that Samsung should stop selling chips to Apple because Apple is evil. Today Apple is deciding to stop buying chips from Samsung and now everyone is still bitching that Apple is evil and that this is a terrible decision.
The hypocrisy of this site never ceases to amaze me.
Exactly….
Read this slow. Apple no longer purchasing chips from samsung doesn’t make them any less evil than they were before. The members on this site are simply stating what consequences apple may face now that what they have been saying should happen hopefully will happen . Exactly!
The point of the article isn’t criticism. The point is, “Get out your Orville Redenbachers and get comfortable. This should be entertaining”.
Read the comments and then get back to me. This site is more focused on Apple bashing than it is Android news, it’s pathetic. It’s almost as if this community doesn’t appreciate competition.
Um, seriously? THIS community doesn’t appreciate competition? Is THIS community the ones trying to hide behind the skirts of Lady Justice rather than competing with superior products that are aggressively updated? Or even comparable products? Is THIS community the ones who in court try to suppress evidence of “prior art” in court?
Apple competes in the smartphone market with one product at a time. Samsung has phones with physical keyboards, larger screens, and in some cases a stylus for those who need more precision than than you can get from a fingertip. They have product depth. The only way Apple can win against that is with patents that were granted on existing technology that wasn’t patented, and smoking gun emails that are just normal internal competitive hyperbole. And getting judges to successfully disallow defenses that demand the same access to internal communications.
The one thing no one from the Apple community can claim, is that Android phone users don’t appreciate competition. We appreciate competition, and we vote with our consumer dollars. Apple is trying to take that vote away from us all over the world.
It was bound to happen sooner or later. Apple just chose to make it sooner. Of course switching suppliers always has consequences somewhere. The question is how this switch will affect the pricing, reliability and supply of future iOS devices.
(Cr) apple (stink different), here comes the start of your doom.
That’s where I stopped reading.
Samsung may lose the revenue from this deal with Apple but they will no longer be spending the money for production of them either. Also, I can bet Apple’s secret technology gets leaked out and stolen a lot quicker with this change!
This makes no sense. They could only do that if there was any company, who has the same semiconductor manufacturing capacity as Samsung, but there’s none. If Apple does it, they better ready themselves for the massive supply shortage. Samsung on the other hand may just get OK out of this, as the other manufacturer will probably just sub-contract them.
I consider this very good move for Samsung. It means that Apple is scrambling and in need of scaring samsung, hoping things change. apparently, Samsungs tactics are working. They are chipping away at Market Share and building the brand as one comparable to Apple. Who cares about the settlement. Its pretty savvy on Samsungs part to approach things this way. Its the George Costanza approach on doing the “opposite” of everyone elses strategies which haven’t worked. I applaud them, and I think Apple is in a pinch with their hurt ego.
History shows Apple went broke once and they can go broke again so enjoy your gloating and your boring Iphone while you can.
Competition breeds innovation.
Lawsuits stifle progress.
Who hurts more, Apple or Samsung? Neither. We as consumers lose out.